Senator Rose-May Poirier

Senator Poirier: Thank you to both witnesses for appearing here today; it’s very much appreciated. My first question is for both witnesses. What do you think the new policy on francophone immigration promised by the federal government should contain? What factors should be considered for that policy to promote vitality and support for the development of francophone minority communities?

Soukaina Boutiyeb, Executive Director, Alliance des femmes de la francophonie canadienne: To answer your first question, I think it’s important — and we submit this in our study — to change the way we look at immigrants. Rather than view immigrant women as service recipients, they must also be seen as members of the community and active participants. Since they help ensure the vitality and enrichment of our communities, part of the objective is to change that perspective.

As our president mentioned in her remarks, the other part of the objective is to consider a gender-sensitive policy. It’s important in policy development to consider gender-based analysis plus, the purpose of which is to develop services that address the specific needs of immigrants based on their identity, gender and economic situation. We must also ensure that those services have a direct impact and can meet all needs.

Mr. Chartrand: I’d like to add something to what my colleague Ms. Boutiyeb just said. The policy must be clear, but everything that follows from it, by which I mean the IRCC regulations, must be as well. We’ve cited two examples of what happens at IRCC and what must change for the francophone community to be vibrant and welcoming and able to develop across Canada, not just in one part of Canada.

Senator Poirier: Thank you for your answer. My second question is for the Fédération nationale des conseils scolaires francophones. What is the current profile of the francophone immigrant school clientele? You made six excellent points in your remarks. How do you think we should prioritize them? Are all six points of equal priority? Where should we start?

Valérie Morand, Executive Director, Fédération nationale des conseils scolaires francophones: Allow me to answer the previous question. The communities’ capacity to take in immigrants must be increased. That includes the school system for francophone immigrants.

Today we heard calls for tougher francophone immigration targets. No one’s opposed to a strong contribution from francophone immigration. To be consistent, however, we have to provide communities and school systems with the resources to admit francophone immigrants. Earlier Ms. Boutiyeb and Ms. Enayeh mentioned the weight of family responsibilities. That’s a factor that we’ve also identified. We’ve also submitted a project to IRCC called RAM, to recruit, admit and retain new teachers, which is based on best practices. We know the solutions. On the advice of our president, we’ve been offering meeting sessions for a few years now. Transportation is provided, snacks are offered, child care is available and parents can socialize and break out of the isolation we mentioned, all of which promotes integration. Children are one vector, but we also give parents a chance to put down roots in the community.

We know what we have to do. Let’s capitalize on these best practices and find the means to implement them. In many cases, the solutions aren’t that complicated. We nevertheless have to acknowledge that they exist and switch out of reactive mode. We know the solutions, so let’s plan and learn from the Syrian refugee experience so we’re ready for the coming wave of Afghan refugees and the wave of francophone Ukrainians. We know the solutions. Let’s give ourselves a chance to implement them.

Senator Poirier: Did you get a positive response to the request for proposals that you issued?

Ms. Morand: It was turned down twice. I didn’t tell you that we didn’t submit it a third time. We see what has to be done, but the onus is on IRCC to acknowledge the reality on the ground. As our president, Mr. Chartrand, said, the settlement workers in school program has to be adapted to the francophone schools model. The system is based on the anglophone model, under which a significant concentration of schools is needed in order to qualify. That’s not the case of the network of francophone schools, which are scattered across the entire province. You often have one council serving the province or territory. Let’s acknowledge the specificity of francophone schools so we can serve this immigrant clientele well.

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Senator Poirier: I’d like to thank the two witnesses for being with us today.

My first question is for Mr. Deschênes-Thériault. In your opening address, you mentioned a study that you had prepared for the Commissioner of Official Languages. In this study, did you receive information about official language minority communities? Are they well equipped to retain newcomers, and is there a lot of migration within the country once the new immigrants come here?

Mr. Deschênes-Thériault: The Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages’ study was published in November.

Retention is still the most important aspect of the francophone integration process, because it is essential to have the required tools and resources to promote successful integration. If the current data and the data from 20 years ago are compared, it becomes clear that much more progress has been made in terms of institutional capacity than in recruitment.

If we look at the tools available to recruit more people internationally, progress over 20 years was much more limited than in the institutional sector. However, there is still work to do, particularly in rural areas. There are certain communities in Toronto, Vancouver and other large Canadian cities where there is a long tradition of immigration, like Moncton and Halifax. In some more rural regions in New Brunswick, where immigration is a relatively new phenomenon and where capacity is now being built in the communities, significant work is needed to promote retention.

I don’t have any specific data on interprovincial migration, but with census data from Statistics Canada, it would be possible to provide an overview of interprovincial migration.

Senator Poirier: My next question, about the post-2023 target, is for the two witnesses.

A target is important, of course, but I’d like to hear what you have to say about the programs, policies and mechanisms the government should adopt, amend or discontinue in order to expand the demographic pool for francophone minority communities.

Ms. Forest: Thank you for the question. I’ll make a start.

It’s true that it’s difficult to set priorities, because there are existing measures of various kinds and they have not led to meeting the 4.4% target. If we want to increase this target, then it’s important to make the required changes to the various programs. For refugees, the government could pay more attention to francophone countries. Each stream would have to be examined and specific measures introduced.

Our study is the first to examine each of the pathways to permanent residence and to identify the main problems with each of them, by presenting options that would attract more immigrants through these pathways.

So if we want to reform each of these programs, our suggestion is that it should be within an office that has significant decision authority and that can introduce follow-up measures. The office should work closely with the francophone communities to ensure that what is done is consistent with their needs and wishes.

Mr. Deschênes-Thériault: I would add that an independent francophone economic immigration program should be established, with an ambitious quota incorporated into the immigration levels plan. That’s one of the first options that should be explored to substantially increase the number of francophone immigrants. The program could be administered under Express Entry or be set up as a completely independent program. The important thing is to have an independent administration system for francophone applicants.

For the Rural and Northern Immigration Pilot mentioned by Ms. Forest, the model used assigns a key role to the communities in selecting applicants. It would be interesting to consider a pilot project like this in francophone communities for which there is less of an immigration tradition, in order to give them the opportunity to select applicants who meet their needs in the economic category.

The provincial and territorial nominee program is also for economic immigration, but it’s administered differently. In Ontario, the bilingual skilled workers stream works rather well. The other provinces could learn from it.

Family sponsorship is rather complex. Capacity to process applications from francophone applicants within a reasonable amount of time would have to be increased, because the Dakar IRCC office serves more different countries than any other office. Some capacity-building would be advisable.

For refugees, more expertise could be hired to deal with emergencies, particularly in sub-Saharan Africa, and this would complement Canada’s international role in terms of refugees.

The Chair: Thank you for your answers.